Ordering without Login
Printed From: ProductCart E-Commerce Solutions
Category: ProductCart
Forum Name: Suggestions
Forum Description: ProductCart Suggestions
URL: https://forum.productcart.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=504
Printed Date: 22-November-2024 at 4:54am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.04 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Ordering without Login
Posted By: ssharp
Subject: Ordering without Login
Date Posted: 31-October-2006 at 12:01pm
I have a client who is using product cart v3. She had an old shopping cart (it was very basic and sucked) but the thing that was nicest about it which we didnt realize until we go product cart was that it didnt require a login. I can't for the life of me figure out why users have such a problem with logging into make an order but her customers do. Since we moved to product cart her orders have been cut by 40% from last year when they didnt have the login requirement.
Albeit the login really makes it easier for the customer and the store owner but it is causing a problem. Now the V3 software does have a feature that allows you to make your first order without creating a password. However on future orders if you try to use the same email address (because you thought you didnt have to login last time) you are told your email is already in the system and you cant order again until you login. This almost pisses people off more than having to create an account in the first place.
So we are thinking of modifying the code with the following procedure. If anyone else is interested in this please let us know. The client is going to pay for the time to write the procedure, but we are willing to help her recoup her costs if anyone else would like to buy the code.
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The first time a user purchases and enters their email address the system will create a random password and save their email address. However on the save we will append a number to the email address so that they next time they order they can use their same email address. Each time they start an order with the same email address we will just append the next number in line so that you might have 10 accounts for the same user but each of them will have the email address with a different number appended at the end. On the administrative side you will still be able to search based on email because of partial matching. However you will have to figure out which order the customer is calling about because there will be multiple records for the same email address in reality. We will make all email processes ignore the number appended at the end so all emails will still go out properly. Any other use of the email address in exports will also ignore the number to keep the email address unique. We know this will be time consuming to address all areas which will be affected but considering the large volume of business this client does and the number of complaints she gets about the login requirement it is worth it for her.
If anyone has any better ideas about how to "get around" the login process please let us know. We have thought about many differnt ways and this is the only one that seems to make sense besides changing the database structure to add a username field and rewriting all the sql. Right now the email address field is the user account field.
Thanks
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Replies:
Posted By: katharina
Date Posted: 31-October-2006 at 12:23pm
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I like this idea, but I think your idea is missing the point of buying without login. Pleople usually prefer this method with the idea that their email address will not be use or stored, or they don't have an email account, or they use a public computer.
My suggestion is to have 3 options for check out:
Existing account customers
New customers creating account
Ordering with out creating an account - no email address
The ones creating an account or those that have an existing account should be rewarded with earning reward points and/or other special offerings. Those that shop without an account can not earn reward points. No order confirmation or tracking number with be emailled.
This will not have an impact on looking up customers, since you can search by name.
Just a thought...
Katharina
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Posted By: ssharp
Date Posted: 02-November-2006 at 3:27pm
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Unless i'm missing something here, there is no option to allow users to order without creating an account. E-mail address is a required field and it is the same field as user name. i believe it would take a rewrite of the database and a significant amount of code to remove email address from the picture and make it optional for those who want to use it.
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Posted By: ProductCart
Date Posted: 02-November-2006 at 3:59pm
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ssharp, that is correct. It would require a big effort, which is one of the reasons why in v3 we were able to introduce a "Checkout without entering a password" feature, but not a "Checkout without registering" feature.
All in all, there are so many advanced features in ProductCart that are tied to the creation and existence of a customer account that right now it simply does not make sense for us to perform the code changes.
In addition, the number of requests for this feature is very small.
That said, enabling http://www.earlyimpact.com/productcart/googlecheckout - Google Checkout (ProductCart v3.04 and above) might provide an alternative as it allows somebody to have one Google account and use it on multiple stores, thus not having to register on the new stores. So if the customer already had a Google account, that customer would be able to checkout on a ProductCart-powered store that has enabled Google Checkout without directly creating an account (but even in that case, an account IS actually created in the ProductCart database based on the information provided to ProductCart by Google Checkout).
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The ProductCart Team
Home of ProductCart http://www.productcart.com" rel="nofollow - shopping cart software
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Posted By: watercrazed
Date Posted: 01-December-2006 at 11:03pm
Well one more vote for account creation not being required. Over 1/2 of our phone orders are from people that do not have/want to provide an email address. Phone orders are not cost effective. Cutting half of them would be a big advance.
P.S. They would not be using google checkout
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John
http://www.ultimatewatermassage.com - massagers, heat therapy, buckwheat pillows and more
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Posted By: kostis
Date Posted: 24-April-2007 at 6:31am
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I agree with watercrazed. The customer has to arrive as fast as possible to the checkout screen without having to login or register. 50% of our orders are telephone orders as well.
An alternative is to use a default email: mailto:nobody@mystore.com - nobody@mystore.com and a default password for this email: "12345" when the email form is left empty. You cannot track orders by customer email but at least your order flow will surely increase.
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Posted By: ssharp
Date Posted: 24-May-2007 at 2:48pm
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FYI we finally ended up writing a "hack" to product cart to allow for express checkout. We basically create a dummy email account in the username field each time a person goes through the checkout with express checkout. They dont get order confirmation emails but the store administrator can looki up their order information. the customers DONT care about the e-mail confirmation. Orders have increased by about 30-40% since writing this express checkout hack and not one person has complained about not getting an email confirmaton. Guess my client was right about this!
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Posted By: MarkCoyle
Date Posted: 24-May-2007 at 4:20pm
I'm glad it's working for you but this will only work for certain types of store.
It's pretty much essential in many stores to have a confirmation email.
For example in ours it provides the download instructions for digital goods.
We have found PayPal Express generates more business anyway as it's a simpler process in itself.
PayPal Pro debit/credit card payments then adds more as it well realised.
Ordering without login as here will be suitable for some but not for all - so people really do need to consider their end to end process requirements fully before making a choice I feel.
cheers
Mark
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Posted By: Hamish
Date Posted: 13-November-2007 at 12:45pm
ssharp,
I would love to know more about simplifying the order process - including ordering without login.
Our site is for people to order sandwiches for collection or delivery - but all C.o.D or account - so we need to keep the ordering system as simple as possible, with fewer screens for customers to go through.
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Posted By: legolas
Date Posted: 19-November-2007 at 5:02pm
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It's funny that this is not a feature of ProductCart when it has so many other features together that other carts do not.
This is, in my opinion, a very basic feature.
As a consumer I can tell you that I myself do not want to create an account at every place I make an order from. I simply don't want to maintain who knows how many accounts at various retailers. I'm sure I have accounts sitting out there I've forgotten about at various online stores that I placed an order with once and was forced to create an account.
Some purchases you simply don't need to create an account for and that shouldn't prevent you from getting email confirmation, shipping notification, or coming back and placing a 2nd order and still not using an account that was created for me the 1st time even though I didn't want one.
For some types of stores it makes a much bigger impact on their target audience and as illustrated in the case of ssharp's client, can actually impact your sales.
Anyhow.. I'll add my vote of making account creation an optional requirement so that it is actually functional.
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Posted By: ProductCart
Date Posted: 19-November-2007 at 5:12pm
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What is the difference between not creating an account and checking out without entering a password (which is already supported)? You enter a billing address, a shipping address, an email where you will be notified of the order status. There are no differences. None. Not even 1 field.
It's just a matter of language, and we believe in telling the truth. You can't use language that would suggest to a customer that you are not storing their information in a database when you indeed are.
Which is why - by the way - all of the top online retailers do NOT offer it. Just start from the top (as ranked by Internet Retailer): Amazon, Staples, Office Depot, etc. etc. etc.
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The ProductCart Team
Home of ProductCart http://www.productcart.com" rel="nofollow - shopping cart software
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Posted By: ssharp
Date Posted: 19-November-2007 at 5:49pm
There is actually a huge difference.
The "checking out without entering a password" feature actually creates a password that is not disclosed to the customer. The first time they order it works beautifully. The problem comes the second time around. They go along adding things to their cart, expecting to use the Early Impact version of quick checkout and they enter their email and choose to "not create a password" and they get the message that the account already exists and it won't let them checkout without logging in. At this point, they are frustrated and leave.
Our method actually prevents them from entering an email address, and we create a dummy email address for them. Of course they don't get order confirmations, but my client can look up the customer's order with their name or phone number - these people usually prefer doing things the hard way anyway which is why they don't want to create accounts. The next time they come back to the site they put in all of their info again and we create yet another dummy email. Its not a perfect solution but the day we did this change her sales starting going up. Month for Month from 2006 - 2007 her sales have been up a minimum of 40% and for the fall and winter months her sales are up 100%. Not all of this can be attributed to this change, but her company is almost 70 years old. That kind of growth doesn't happen after 70 years. She did no extra advertising, and as a matter of fact she has cut her google Adwords spend by about 75% and she is still bringing in twice the volume she did last year. The only major change is the Express Checkout Hack we wrote.
Trust me - we didn't approach this lightly - we told her she was crazy - that noone wants to shop without creating an account. I mean none of us do that - but none of us are grannys who sit at home and sew and hate being on the computer. That is her primary customer. We went through all the channels of speaking to developers at Early Impact as to whether there was a future release that had this level of express checkout option and we were assured it would not happen.
So we did what we had to satisfy the customer, and happily for us, it has made a tremendous improvement in her sales. Most of her customers checkout that way believe it or not. So maybe amazon and the other major retailers you mentioned might want to take a lesson. Pottery Barn for Kids has this feature and i'm sure its for a reason.
Again it might not be right for every business, and you and I might not shop that way, but her customers do and it was right for her store. It may be a feature you should consider building in!
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Posted By: ProductCart
Date Posted: 19-November-2007 at 6:13pm
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Thank you for the additional feedback.
In version 3.11 we changed the message that is returned to the customer when they use an e-mail that already exists in the database, and detect that a random password had been created for them. The message better explains why the e-mail already exists.
The increase in sales on your client store was very likely not related to this feature as it only affects repeat purchases, as you indicated yourself. There was probably an increase in the amount of unique visitors, a decrease in the bounce rate, and an increase in page views: you probably did a good job with SEO and site design!
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The ProductCart Team
Home of ProductCart http://www.productcart.com" rel="nofollow - shopping cart software
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Posted By: geoff
Date Posted: 19-November-2007 at 9:42pm
ssharp - thanks for the comments.
Based on your ideas, I am inspired to also do this hack. I get a number of customers who are highly conservative and reticent to provide an email. Providing choice is IMO a good thing. Currently, I get good conversion once the customer has registered but the drop -off between viewcart and registering is quiet high.
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Posted By: amytxus
Date Posted: 20-November-2007 at 3:32pm
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We have 2 online stores that have been up and running for several years. When people call us on the phone to place an order, we always ask for their email address. You would be surprised at how many people do not want to give it to you and the funny thing is that they will readily give you their credit card information. I usually explain the email address is only used to send them order confirmation and shipment tracking information and then they are generally willing to give it out. It would be helpful if people could skip entering their email address and just enter their billing, shipping, and payment information. I'm sure there are potential customers that we lose because of this requirement. I realize that the top retailers require it, but the big boys can require things and do things differently than your average small online store.
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Posted By: cpgmar
Date Posted: 29-November-2007 at 10:32am
In our store we also have several "granny" types that are either not able to check email or not comfortable "registering" with anyone. What happens is that they then call us on the phone and it takes valuable time to take their order manually. (BTW it would be nice to have a "quick phone order" interface within admin.)
We have always entered these customers with a dummy email and pw and although they don't get emails, we realize that they wouldn't anyway as many don't even check their email on a regular basis. We flag these orders so that we know contact needs to be by phone. Maybe there would be an option for "no email" in the express version.
I really like the idea of the "Express Checkout" as long it is clear that communications from us are always by email so they would lose that ability to receive confirming, tracking and order change emails. Many times the customer only intends to order one time only and unfortunately we have to respect that and make it easier for them. Walking into a brick & mortar store is what we don't want them to do and they are generally only asked for a zip code if that.
I know that customers still have to enter all the info for name address phone etc but calling it "express" and not making things "required" goes a long way for many potential customers and saves our customer service dept. time on the phone. We currently don't use the "no password required" feature because it doesn't solve the no email problem. It is easy for us who are online all the time to forget that there are many folks out there still very unfamiliar with the web and email.
Please let us know if a mod is written that can do this automatically.
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Cindy
The Tasteful Garden
www.tastefulgarden.com
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Posted By: mimpoz
Date Posted: 28-January-2008 at 12:09pm
Lately I have had many customers complain (since they have integrated google analytics) of a very high drop off from the view cart to checkout/login. One of my customers requested we do something like http://www.magellans.com checkout. Basically what they have is when you checkout you come to the page with the where you fill out your shipping information and on the right hand side it gives you the option to log in. Further more when you put in your email address there is check box Save your information for future purchases. If you check it ,it gives you the ability to create a password right there. My customer thinks this checkout is great it skips the login page there by not scaring off customers.. and asks for an email address(so the users get the confirmations) but does not require creating a password. Can anyone think of a way to integrate this into product cart?
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e-Notations
http://www.e-notations.com - Website design and development
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Posted By: cpgmar
Date Posted: 28-January-2008 at 2:49pm
I think that is great, if it helps...the fear factor is really tangible for so many people. Please let me know if this modification can be done.
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Cindy
The Tasteful Garden
www.tastefulgarden.com
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