Question for developers about custom price vs ...

How could it be this difficult to get a straight answer?  Honestly, it's a yes or no question... regardless of the relativity of pricing to other companies... can you or can you not always charge more for a 'custom' job as oppose to selling a premade module?

Of course, the developer is getting paid something for the work... so your remarks regarding paying the developer for his expertise are just beside the point.

I'm looking for yes or no answers, not runaround politician answers.  Really, you're just proving my point by the way you talk around my question.

I already know the answer, I was just hoping someone else would actually admit to it - but, I guess a group of developers aren't exactly the right people to ask - since it sounds like you all rationalize this type of deceitful behavior.

This is what I'm talking about - the mindset of people who work in these type of service-based industries are typically shady (there are always possible exceptions) - it's like politics.  Because, there are no real standards for pricing you assume you can just do whatever you want, tell a little lie here and there to make a few extra bucks - stretch out the time you need to spend on a project to get paid more, anything to prey on the ignorance of the customer, just like an auto mechanic.

The bottom line is that a company can always charge more for a completely custom job as oppose to selling a premade module... but I guess that's too difficult of a thing to admit or something.

And, that was really the only point I was trying to make.


Edited by JWL - 17-September-2009 at 11:07am

Reread my last post... yea, I agree developers are skilled and they may also be very amiable... but politicians are amiable, so that doesn't count for much.

A developer will get the job done, that's not the point - the point is principle and ethics.  It's about being honest... even when you have the opportunity to get away with being dishonest - but, I guess - people don't really understand what that means.

Also, if a company develops a single computer for a client from scratch, than yes - the price for that job could cost hundreds of thousands if not millions, but if that same computer is in mass production and resold to everyone, than the price would only be a few thousand for the same computer.

So, are you saying that if a computer company went around charging every customer a development price instead of a retail price, that you wouldn't have a problem with that?  Because, that is what a developer is doing by charging multiple customers a development price for code that has already been developed.


Edited by JWL - 17-September-2009 at 3:19am

No one is airing dirty laundry - this is a general topic, as no companies have been mentioned.  Also, maybe I would feel a little better if a developer could give me an example of something that they would consider unethical - because the thing that unnerves me the most - is that it sounds like anything can be rationalized as being ethical.

I would honestly like to know what a developer considers unethical behavior, besides stealing someone's code or something of that nature. I'm talking about unethical action between the developer and client.

For example, if a developer says a custom job took 5 hours when it only took 2 hours (no code was reused, everything was new code) is that ethical behavior - because, the developer lost money on another project, so they are justified in making up for it on this project... or maybe - the developer just arbitrarily decided to charge more, depending on what he wanted to make for the job - and that's justified because developers don't have to abide by or honor their own pricing model.

They can advertise a low per hour rate, say $80hr - but then charge as much as they want to by simply breaking down the total to that per hour rate, even though they are charging the customer for time that wasn't even spent on the project.

And, this is rationalized, by saying any charge over the actual amount of time it takes to complete the work is a hidden "expertise" fee.  This so-called expertise fee, should already be factored into your per hour pricing, because it's part of your service... if your expertise isn't included in the per hour rate, than what is?!  Without the expertise, you couldn't even do any work - which means the per hour rate is worth nothing.

So, if the above event were to take place - you have a case of false advertising - because the developer is saying their time costs $80hr.  But, in actuality - on this project their time cost $200hr - because the customer was charged $400 for 2 hours of time.  And, this is perfectly acceptable and ethical behavior?  Note: This 5 hour charge is separate from any other billable fees associated with the project, such as consulation etc.

"The engineer then sends the factory a bill for $1000.00.  The factory protests: "All you did is wack it with a hammer!" The engineer then explains that it was only $1.00 for the hammer wack, but $999.00 to know where to wack it."

You are lacking proper context.  What if the engineer told the factory that he charges $100 per hour for his services... and, it only took him an hour to fix the problem, but then sent a bill for $1000.  That means he advertised $100 an hour, but actually charged $1000 per hour.


Edited by JWL - 17-September-2009 at 10:21am

And, I would just like to clarify my position because apparently there is a lot of confusion.  I am NOT saying that there is anything wrong with reusing code.  I am NOT saying that there is anything wrong with charging a certain fee for reused code.

The point I am making is a matter of ethics.  Now, let's say you were to reuse an identical copy/pasted code from a previous project on a new project.  And, this new client asked you if this code had been used on another website, and you said, "No, it is new code."  Would you have any issue with telling that lie?

According to what some have said, a developer can charge any price they want to, so what would be the benefit in lying to your customer and telling them it was new code as opposed to copy/pasted code?

There is no point in lying unless there is something to benefit or gain, so if a developer did lie about this... what would be their reasoning, since according to others in this thread - a developer can basically charge whatever they want regardless if the code is new or reused.

I think this is a much clearer description of the point I am trying to make, so I would appreciate some honest replies in regards to this situation, because I am honestly confounded as to the rationalization behind this type of behavior.

When someone tells me a bald face lie, I feel deeply disrespected, insulted and exploited.  So, my question is... what would be the motivation for saying code is new when it's actually copy/pasted code?  There must be something to gain, otherwise - there is no need for the lie.

And, one last thing - this has nothing to do with being perfect.  Everyone makes mistakes - but, it's one thing to make an honest mistake - and it's another thing to consciously and knowingly lie to a customer in order to achieve some sort of gain.

Edited by JWL - 17-September-2009 at 8:59am

Is it not possible to have an open discussion about the ethics involved in the developer profession without it being turned into some sort of fake drama?  I really want to know what developers consider unethical behavior.

Please, don't read into something that's not there... because it seems like that's what you're doing for some reason.

Also, if I do conduct business with a developer or e-tailer or anyone for that matter, and I want the public to know about my experience than I will write a review, but that's not what this thread is about.

This is a general topic, directed at all developers.  Do you not want to discuss the ethics involved in your line of work?  All I am doing is asking questions, if someone asked questions like this in regard to my profession, I would not hesitate for a second to give them a straight and honest answer.


Edited by JWL - 18-September-2009 at 4:21am